Fanblogs.com: ACC looking at divisional realignment?
Rob Williams
· 9 months ago
I thought the original idea was jacked anyway - trying to set up a conf champ game based on who was good at the time. Still looks similar. why not just let geography do the split and let'em play? I still think there should be a "north" and "south" split. Have to divide NC in half (4 in the "south", 4 in the "north", 4 in NC)
War_Eagle_Atlanta
· 9 months ago
My point exactly. Having divisions called coastal and atlantic is a little redundant.
Clemson_Joe
· 9 months ago
Kevin, I'd really like to see the article. I'm a member of TigerIllustrated, but not WarChant (obviously). Is there some way that I can see it? Do I have to sign up for a 7 day trial with WarChant?
Kevin @ Fanblogs
· 9 months ago
You can petition the CU board to repost for members only, or you can seven day trial warchant. I would do the 7 day trial if I were you.
Clemson_Joe
· 9 months ago
Current permanent rivals: Boston College - Virginia Tech Clemson - Georgia Tech Florida State - Miami Maryland - Virginia NC State - North Carolina Wake Forest - Duke
What I'd like to see... North Boston College Duke Maryland North Carolina Virginia Virginia Tech
South Clemson Florida State Georgia Tech Miami NC State Wake Forest
...and the new permanent rivals: Boston College - Clemson (game already has a rivalry trophy) Duke - Wake Forest (no change) Maryland - Florida State (interchangeable with UVA - GT) North Carolina - NC State (no change) Virginia - Georgia Tech (interchangeable with UMd - FSU) Virginia Tech - Miami (old Big East rivals)
Porcine
· 9 months ago
Hurrumph!
Clemson_Joe
· 9 months ago
I have to admit, I had to look that one up in the urban dictionary.
So, you're tired of something or angry about something?
Care to elaborate what is it about my post that angered you?
Porcine
· 9 months ago
Have you seen Blazing Saddles?
Clemson_Joe
· 9 months ago
It's been so long I had to youtube it, but I do remember it now.
That one completely passed me by, man, but I get it now.
Zac
· 9 months ago
So? Give the governor a Hurrumph! (Of course, after you do, he's only gonna say, "You watch your a$$!")
Ramblin' Gator
· 9 months ago
I like your simplified alignment, but something tells me the ACC will never (ever?) put Miami and FSU in the same division. They're still dreaming of that big matchup in the championship game.
Clemson_Joe
· 9 months ago
I think you're right, but it really is time for them to get over that. Neither Miami or Florida State is the same as they were before the realignment took place. At that time, both were a good bit better than everyone else in the league. Now that isn't even remotely true.
Ramblin' Gator
· 9 months ago
It appears the ACC along with fans of both schools are hoping the Canes and the Noles return to their former glory. Given each school's prowess for recruiting it certainly appears they might climb back. But given recent events (punitive actions at FSU, loss of DC at Miami) it may take a lot longer than their fans are hoping.
1Tomcat
· 9 months ago
I agree with your assesment-however in the 12-south we have the heavy weights in the same division, why not ACC? BC just dosn't belong geographically at all- heck they are a long, long way from Miami- like WEA said Coastal & Atlantic is redundant. The current alinement is just fine, but north & south would work too. BTW looking foward to Baylor @ Wake next season
Ramblin' Gator
· 9 months ago
For what it's worth, I personally don't agree with the line of thinking that wants FSU and Miami in the ACC championship game every year - and not for the obvious reason.
The Southwest Conference fell apart when Arkansas left and it became a state of Texas-only conference. If the ACC championship was reduced to the same two teams from the same state in the title game most years, the ACC would fall (farther?) from significance.
Besides, I want GT in the title game every year. :-)
Big B
· 9 months ago
Please tell me you are kidding here. That North division is likely to get more flack (and deservedly so) than the Big Least. Virginia Tech and a bunch of crappy second tier schools. No way the ACC does this, though if they do, I would be the first to lead the charge to strip it of its automatic BCS berth unless the champ comes out of the South. No offense to Duke, Maryland, North Carolina and Virginia, but these are all very weak teams. BC has had some decent teams, but Doug Flutie and Matt Ryan does not a conference powerhouse make. On the otherhand, four of the six in the South are exceedingly impressive, and I would have to say coming through that unscathed is certainly on par with coming through the SEC East.
Clemson_Joe
· 9 months ago
No, I'm not kidding at all actually. The ACC proved this past season just how close every member team is to the others in terms of strengths. Virginia Tech has proved to be a steady and strong program. Boston College has been to the ACC Championship game more than once, and it's tough to argue that they haven't been one of the top teams in the league over the last few years. Doug Flutie and Matt Ryan weren't on the team when they last one their division. North Carolina is certainly on the rise, and will be strong again soon. Maryland was 11-3 in 2002, and 10-3 in 2003. They have been "rebuilding" since then, but they have a good coach, and they have to facilities to have success. In my opinion, if Virginia were to get rid of their coach and get someone worth his salt, that program would come back very quickly. If you look at the NFL talent coming out of Charlottesville, it makes you wonder quite a bit about the guy in charge and his lack of success. Duke is still Duke, but they are much better, and things are looking up for them with Coach Cutcliffe who is signed on through 2015.
In the south, there are plenty of big question marks to be answered for each program. Clemson has a brand new first year head coach. Florida State is now on probation and will undoubtedly undergo a coaching change in the next few seasons. Can Coach Grobe sustain the successes he's had of late even if the other programs step up? Can O'Brien have any success at NC State? This year will tell a lot. Miami isn't the 'Canes of old, and it's yet to be seen if they ever will be again. As of now they are mediocre. GT had some first year success under Coach Johnson, but how will that hold up with his recruits, and will the "Hideo Nomo effect" take place in the ACC?
For a not so hypothetical, and more quantifiable response, I'll turn to the final Sagarin ratings from this past season. Current Alignment Average - Atlantic: 78.10 Average - Coastal: 77.25 Delta: 0.85
My Proposed Alignment Average - North: 77.12 Average - South: 78.23 Delta: 1.11
That's only a change in the difference of strength of the 2 divisions of a whopping 0.26. Almost every school is more than 0.26 behind the school ranked above them. In his system, 0.26 is pretty insignificant.
Essentially all that I did is trade out Georgia Tech and Miami for Boston College and Maryland. Historically this doesn't look fair at all, but in reality are Georgia Tech and Miami collectively much different from Boston College and Maryland? I certainly don't think so, and I think you'd have a hard time proving otherwise.
My system makes sense for the ACC for travel, and rivalries. I'm not saying the ACC will do it, but I think the Conference would be better suited if it did.
Porcine
· 9 months ago
For the halibut I used your divisional scenario and applied it to last season's results. This is how it would have ended up.
North Con Div Overall Boston College 5-3 2-1 9-5 Virginia Tech 5-3 4-1 10-4 Maryland 4-4 1-3 8-5 North Carolina 4-4 2-3 8-5 Virginia 3-5 2-2 5-7 Duke 1-7 1-2 4-8
South Georgia Tech 5-3 3-0 9-4 Florida State 5-3 3-2 9-4 NC State 4-4 2-2 6-7 Wake Forest 4-4 2-2 8-5 Clemson 4-4 1-3 7-6 Miami 4-4 1-3 7-6
I used head-to-head and divisional records as tie-breakers. It looks like a BC-GT title bout. Edit: I put spaces in there, but alas.
RazzMaTazz
· 8 months ago
Geographically, technically (nitpickingly) Wake & Duke would be in the North, and UNC & NCSU would be in the South. That would necessitate Duke and UNC being permanent rivals.
Regan
· 9 months ago
Bizarrely enough, I think the ACC divisions are just fine. I've looked at them, and I can't find any reason to mix them up. Thinking honestly, last season showed just how balanced the ACC was, and pairity was the name of the game. Mixing up the ACC won't make anything better.
IF the ACC was to be realigned, though, I'd want it to be upon geographical lines, in which case, Clemson_Joe's alignment works. The only problem is that I wouldn't want CLEM to have to play FSU, GT, MIA, and WF every year. (WF and NCSU are technically geographically south of UNC and DUKE)
CLEM would essentially swap MARY for MIA yearly, which I DO NOT WANT TO SEE MORE THAN FOUR TIMES A DECADE (in the regular season).
Also, IF this happened, as far as 'permanent rivals' goes, I think it should be: > CLEM-MARY (this used to be the historical big rivalry in the ACC) > MIA-BC (fits like a glove) > WF-DUKE (no change) > NCSU-UNC (no change) > GT-VT (Techno Twins) > FSU-UVA (Jefferson-Epps Trophy)
I'm still kinda foggy on just why re-alignment is even on the table/desired. The only upside I can think of is that CLEM and BC wouldn't have to play every year. (BC doesn't belong in the ACC anyway...I wanted SCAR, WVU, or USF.)
*continues grumbling incessantly*
Kevin @ Fanblogs
· 9 months ago
If I were going to change anything, I would probably look at bringing Georgia Tech into the Atlantic. I'm not sure if GT is initiating this or not, but when you look at their division, there really isn't anyone within bus range - every division game is a flight and that gets pricey. GT in the atlantic would also lock in a geo-rivalry with FSU and guarantee both schools another sellout - probably in all sports (mens/womens).
If you move GT, the trick becomes... who do you swap? BC really doesn't pair up well in either division, but at least they have Maryland for a "close" division game. I suppose that's equally true if you move them to the Coastal and UVa becomes a "close" game. That move might make sense to some because you've got your former Big East mates all together. That said, I know FSU agreed to BC in the Atlantic because of the potential to recruit basketball/football in the Northeast.
If you move Wake, you essentially get the VA/NC division, plus Miami. That would get a lot of attention, but I'm not sure it's "good" for the conference to be so limited in its geographical exposure. Somebody talk me into moving Wake, because they have ruined us for the past three years.
I think you also have to look "balance of power" in other sports, as well. I'm not sure any change is neccesary at this point, but... it sounds like someone within the ACC is trying to push it.
TigerEducated
· 9 months ago
Kevin...You are going to FORCE me to post that Alabama story, aren't you?
DAMMIT!!!!!!!!
Regan
· 9 months ago
?
OU_Ron
· 9 months ago
NCAA and books, I would have thought you would have already posted it...
TigerEducated
· 9 months ago
I found out about it from a friend who told me that the REC was leaning on the publisher to prevent them from running the story in the paper...
Alabama released a statement to attempt to quell the story when they went ahead and ran with it...
I refuse to put something up, on the grounds that while I hate Alabama, I don't want to be typecast here [sarcasm]...
OU_Ron
· 9 months ago
I wouldn't worry about it TE, I think you will still be loved and respected just as much as you ever were by the Bama fans......
The_Observer
· 9 months ago
As soon as I heard the story yesterday, I wondered to myself.."How long will this take TE to post on Fanblogs?"
OU_Ron
· 9 months ago
Alabama to TE is like a laxative, it dosen't take long to make him move....;-)
War_Eagle_Atlanta
· 9 months ago
LMAO!!
Wardboy3
· 9 months ago
Now that is the funniest thing I have read in quite a while!!!!!!!!!
TigerEducated
· 9 months ago
I've been e-mailing WEA, Kevin & Ben begging them to run something the past two days...
They refuse to respond...LOL...
Kevin @ Fanblogs
· 9 months ago
I've got my own NCAA story to run this afternoon. Maybe The Observer will man up and email me something???
Gator_Babe812
· 9 months ago
what is the story???
TigerEducated
· 9 months ago
The Schoolbooks thing that they had to suspend Caldwell, Coffee, and a few others for last year had been going on since 2005...
An Alabama paper was going to run the story, and I heard some heavy hitters from the "Red Elaphant Club" were leaning on the publisher to squelch it.
When they ran with it anyway, Alabama released a pre-emptory statement about how it was garbage...yet the NCAA has been investigating since it was released.
The word I hear is that Mike Slive kept a lid on it until CBS backed the brinks' truck up and spent a Billion on the conference in the recent TV deal, and now he's not hiding it, anymore.
This is something that was ongoing prior to Saban's arrival, and mind you, he's not implicated in any way, but folks, Alabama fans can say what they like, but the bottom line is that they were told if any major/serious infractions occurred while they were on probation for the Albert Means' thing, then the punishment would likely include a shutdown of their football program.
Alabama's report to the NCAA already included the term "gross failure to monitor" the situation, and that's admission of fault...and its DANGEROUSLY close to being construed as "Lack of Institutional Control" depending upon which lawyers you ask...
Be careful, folks...
OU_Ron
· 9 months ago
Another dose of Bama-Lax
Zac
· 9 months ago
Or would that be Ala-whoop. (Couldn't bring myself to use the other word.)
Wait a minute; wait a minute. At Bama's home games, are they singing, "We just whooped your a$$," or "We just wiped your a$$"? Cause, if it's the latter, I think I get it now.
War_Eagle_Atlanta
· 9 months ago
I thought it was a rhetorical request...
War_Eagle_Atlanta
· 9 months ago
When I heard the story from TE yesterday, I wondered to myself How long will this take TE to post it on Fanblogs...
TigerEducated
· 9 months ago
LOL...
I love Schadenfreude...
4cornerz
· 9 months ago
Well at least the ACC wont have to worry about FSU
NMLSooner
· 9 months ago
Exchange Boston College and South Florida with the Big East North Division: Maryland, Virginia, Virginia Tech, North Carolina, North Carolina State, Duke South DIvision: Wake Forest, Clemson, Georgia Tech, Florida State, South Florida, Miami, Fla.
badgerballer
· 8 months ago
I just plain need help with the divisional terms. I mean, aren't "Atlantic" and "Coastal" synonymous?
War_Eagle_Atlanta
· 8 months ago
Hell no, BB. Of course, we couldn't expect a guy from a landlocked (ocean) state to realize that...
Damn mid-westerner...
:-)
Zac
· 8 months ago
"Damn mid-westerner..."
Hense the word "plain".
Clemson_Joe
· 8 months ago
I don't really understand this confusion. The conference is named the Atlantic Coast Conference. The divisions are not geographical, hence the Atlantic, and Coast(al).
Now, please explain to me why the Big Televen can't count.
VTBobb
· 8 months ago
What I really want to know is who is the Small 1?
Zac
· 8 months ago
So, does this not put a damper on the driving convenience you discussed in another thread?
VTBobb
· 8 months ago
Who, me?
Porcine
· 8 months ago
Notre Dame.
ndellobuono
· 8 months ago
Divisions are the problem in large conferences. By having divisions, they are ensuring themselves of not having the best teams play thereby hurting the BCS chances of having#1 vs #2 play.
IE. Last year, the Big 12 had Okl vs Missouri in their title game. Missouri was at least the 5th best team in the conference. They got a crap matchup which hurt ratings and did nothing to solve their BCS mess between Texas and OKL. The game should have served as a defacto playoff game elimating a team from BCS discussion.
Another example- Two years ago SEC had LSU and Ten in the game. Ga was ranked in the top 10 and had a better record than Tennessee. Ten won the division and played in the title game. Last year thru luck, the SEC got the best two teams in Florida and Alabama. They got a great rating and helped to clear up some of the national title picture.
The divisions should be thrown out. The top two teams in the conference play in the conference title game serving as potential elimination games for the BCS.
VTBobb
· 8 months ago
So do you believe you should have to win your conference to be considered for the NC?
Regan
· 8 months ago
I do...someone asked for NC qualifications? :-)
RazzMaTazz
· 8 months ago
We could take all of the schools that are close to the Atlantic coast (and closer than the other in-state ACC schools) and put them together in the coastal division. Without looking at a map, I think that gives us. Coastal: Miami, NCSU, Wake, UMD, UVA, & BC. Atlantic (or more inland): FSU, Clemson, GT, UNC, Duke, & VT.
That's still likely to leave the Atlantic a lot stronger than the Coastal but it's not a terrible split. Then again, it's not really any better.
The one thing that I think is weird about the ACC is that, in order to preserve some traditional rivalries while creating similarly competitive divisions, the ACC created annual out-of-division "permanent rivals" which create permanent unfairness. For example, in the Atlantic division, Wake gets to play (Coastal) Duke every year (which is practically a guaranteed win) whereas Clemson has to play (Coastal) GT every year, which is a 50-50 proposition. Therefore Wake has a perennial advantage over Clemson to win the Atlantic Division.
The ACC could have avoided that problem by putting rivals in the same divsion. To be honest, I'm not sure who everybody's rivals are, but if I had to take a whack at it, I think it would look something like this. All the NC schools are rivals of each other. Clemson & GT. UVA & VT & maybe UMD. BC & Miami, and Miami & FSU. So a rivalry split (and an abandonment of the unfair "permanent rivals" scheduling) could be something like: Coastal: UMD, UVA, VT, BC, Miami, FSU. Atlantic: NCSU, UNC, Duke, Wake, Clemson, GT.
Of course that makes the Coastal a lot stronger than the Atlantic, and it prevents the possibility of the FSU-Miami dream match-up championship game were those two schools to return to power.
Clemson_Joe
· 8 months ago
Call me crazy, but I still like the North-South geographical alignment. I really think it would make for stronger rivalries in the future, and a better "divisional sense" like other conferences have.
Porcine
· 8 months ago
I agree. As I posted above. the divisions are fairly equal.
RazzMaTazz
· 8 months ago
Oops. I just looked at a map. I didn't realize that Wake is in Winston-Salem. So a geographic Coastal-Atlantic split would look like: Coastal: Miami, NCSU, Duke, UMD, UVA, & BC. Atlantic (or more inland): FSU, Clemson, GT, UNC, Wake, & VT.
Coastal would be way stronger than the Atlantic. Bad idea.
vtmechE
· 8 months ago
one of my friends started a playoff proposal, with some radical changes in terms of conference alignments and who was where, keeping geographical proximity a priority, BC doesn't belong in the acc is kinda a trick, b/c 1. bc has the academics, and 2. they have the athletics, thy do not have a strong or travelling strong fan base, nor do they have the geographical proximity,
however, they have the academics, and in order to exchange bc with another southern school, one would have to look at 1. navy (20 mins. from umd), 2. take someone from the sec, south carolina gets my vote, or 3. get a southern fcs school with the academics, cuz those sec schools won't give up the money they make from cbs, usf, ecu, and ucf (the other possibilities) don't have the academics, navy gets my vote, not only do they have the academics and the fans, but they also don't have to deal with separating from another conference, plus lacrosse would benefit, and so too would mens soccer, which the acc has strength nationally, basketball would suffer, but i don't think it'll be a big deal
i like the north south divisions clemson joe posted, switching bc for navy
RazzMaTazz
· 8 months ago
I never really thought of BC as a really good academic school but I just looked up the average SAT scores and it looks like BC is distant second to Duke but very similar to Wake, UVA, and GT in academics. (Interestingly, if Duke were in the Ivy League, academically Duke would be about tied with Dartmouth for the 4th best school behind Harvard, Yale, & Princeton.) If SoCar were to join the ACC, it would be the weakest ACC school academically (as would USF if it were to join). Navy is one of the most selective schools in the country, but in terms of SAT scores, it looks like they'd be middle of the pack for the ACC. However, I think Navy would bring down the football & basketball competitiveness of the ACC, so I wouldn't want to swap them for BC.
hokieglenn
· 8 months ago
Everytime this realignment thing comes up you can find a perfect solution, some rivalry is going to get left out or some aspect won't work. I wish VT played Maryland more.
They should abandon divisions. Divisions do nothing to help get the best two teams in the conference championship game (ie. Big 12 last year) Have all 12 teams play rotating schedule keeping rival games. Top two teams play for the conference title.
CollegeFootballAddict
· 6 months ago
Uh...keep Navy. Notre Dame. USF. and everyone else out of the obviously superior conference. We'd be glad to drop Maryland, Duke, Virginia, or Clemson and take USF or Cincinnati instead. Besides, who needs logic in a conference....Big 10 had 11 people and thinking of stealing Rutgers to make it the Big10+2
Clemson_Joe
· 6 months ago
Thanks. That's the best laugh that I've had in a while.
CollegeFootballAddict
· 6 months ago
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All Comments
Boston College - Virginia Tech
Clemson - Georgia Tech
Florida State - Miami
Maryland - Virginia
NC State - North Carolina
Wake Forest - Duke
What I'd like to see...
North
Boston College
Duke
Maryland
North Carolina
Virginia
Virginia Tech
South
Clemson
Florida State
Georgia Tech
Miami
NC State
Wake Forest
...and the new permanent rivals:
Boston College - Clemson (game already has a rivalry trophy)
Duke - Wake Forest (no change)
Maryland - Florida State (interchangeable with UVA - GT)
North Carolina - NC State (no change)
Virginia - Georgia Tech (interchangeable with UMd - FSU)
Virginia Tech - Miami (old Big East rivals)
So, you're tired of something or angry about something?
Care to elaborate what is it about my post that angered you?
That one completely passed me by, man, but I get it now.
BTW looking foward to Baylor @ Wake next season
The Southwest Conference fell apart when Arkansas left and it became a state of Texas-only conference. If the ACC championship was reduced to the same two teams from the same state in the title game most years, the ACC would fall (farther?) from significance.
Besides, I want GT in the title game every year. :-)
Virginia Tech has proved to be a steady and strong program.
Boston College has been to the ACC Championship game more than once, and it's tough to argue that they haven't been one of the top teams in the league over the last few years. Doug Flutie and Matt Ryan weren't on the team when they last one their division.
North Carolina is certainly on the rise, and will be strong again soon.
Maryland was 11-3 in 2002, and 10-3 in 2003. They have been "rebuilding" since then, but they have a good coach, and they have to facilities to have success.
In my opinion, if Virginia were to get rid of their coach and get someone worth his salt, that program would come back very quickly. If you look at the NFL talent coming out of Charlottesville, it makes you wonder quite a bit about the guy in charge and his lack of success.
Duke is still Duke, but they are much better, and things are looking up for them with Coach Cutcliffe who is signed on through 2015.
In the south, there are plenty of big question marks to be answered for each program. Clemson has a brand new first year head coach.
Florida State is now on probation and will undoubtedly undergo a coaching change in the next few seasons.
Can Coach Grobe sustain the successes he's had of late even if the other programs step up?
Can O'Brien have any success at NC State? This year will tell a lot.
Miami isn't the 'Canes of old, and it's yet to be seen if they ever will be again. As of now they are mediocre.
GT had some first year success under Coach Johnson, but how will that hold up with his recruits, and will the "Hideo Nomo effect" take place in the ACC?
For a not so hypothetical, and more quantifiable response, I'll turn to the final Sagarin ratings from this past season.
Current Alignment
Average - Atlantic: 78.10
Average - Coastal: 77.25
Delta: 0.85
My Proposed Alignment
Average - North: 77.12
Average - South: 78.23
Delta: 1.11
That's only a change in the difference of strength of the 2 divisions of a whopping 0.26. Almost every school is more than 0.26 behind the school ranked above them. In his system, 0.26 is pretty insignificant.
Essentially all that I did is trade out Georgia Tech and Miami for Boston College and Maryland. Historically this doesn't look fair at all, but in reality are Georgia Tech and Miami collectively much different from Boston College and Maryland? I certainly don't think so, and I think you'd have a hard time proving otherwise.
My system makes sense for the ACC for travel, and rivalries. I'm not saying the ACC will do it, but I think the Conference would be better suited if it did.
North Con Div Overall
Boston College 5-3 2-1 9-5
Virginia Tech 5-3 4-1 10-4
Maryland 4-4 1-3 8-5
North Carolina 4-4 2-3 8-5
Virginia 3-5 2-2 5-7
Duke 1-7 1-2 4-8
South
Georgia Tech 5-3 3-0 9-4
Florida State 5-3 3-2 9-4
NC State 4-4 2-2 6-7
Wake Forest 4-4 2-2 8-5
Clemson 4-4 1-3 7-6
Miami 4-4 1-3 7-6
I used head-to-head and divisional records as tie-breakers. It looks like a BC-GT title bout.
Edit: I put spaces in there, but alas.
IF the ACC was to be realigned, though, I'd want it to be upon geographical lines, in which case, Clemson_Joe's alignment works. The only problem is that I wouldn't want CLEM to have to play FSU, GT, MIA, and WF every year. (WF and NCSU are technically geographically south of UNC and DUKE)
CLEM would essentially swap MARY for MIA yearly, which I DO NOT WANT TO SEE MORE THAN FOUR TIMES A DECADE (in the regular season).
Also, IF this happened, as far as 'permanent rivals' goes, I think it should be:
> CLEM-MARY (this used to be the historical big rivalry in the ACC)
> MIA-BC (fits like a glove)
> WF-DUKE (no change)
> NCSU-UNC (no change)
> GT-VT (Techno Twins)
> FSU-UVA (Jefferson-Epps Trophy)
I'm still kinda foggy on just why re-alignment is even on the table/desired. The only upside I can think of is that CLEM and BC wouldn't have to play every year. (BC doesn't belong in the ACC anyway...I wanted SCAR, WVU, or USF.)
*continues grumbling incessantly*
If you move GT, the trick becomes... who do you swap? BC really doesn't pair up well in either division, but at least they have Maryland for a "close" division game. I suppose that's equally true if you move them to the Coastal and UVa becomes a "close" game. That move might make sense to some because you've got your former Big East mates all together. That said, I know FSU agreed to BC in the Atlantic because of the potential to recruit basketball/football in the Northeast.
If you move Wake, you essentially get the VA/NC division, plus Miami. That would get a lot of attention, but I'm not sure it's "good" for the conference to be so limited in its geographical exposure. Somebody talk me into moving Wake, because they have ruined us for the past three years.
I think you also have to look "balance of power" in other sports, as well. I'm not sure any change is neccesary at this point, but... it sounds like someone within the ACC is trying to push it.
DAMMIT!!!!!!!!
Alabama released a statement to attempt to quell the story when they went ahead and ran with it...
I refuse to put something up, on the grounds that while I hate Alabama, I don't want to be typecast here [sarcasm]...
They refuse to respond...LOL...
An Alabama paper was going to run the story, and I heard some heavy hitters from the "Red Elaphant Club" were leaning on the publisher to squelch it.
When they ran with it anyway, Alabama released a pre-emptory statement about how it was garbage...yet the NCAA has been investigating since it was released.
The word I hear is that Mike Slive kept a lid on it until CBS backed the brinks' truck up and spent a Billion on the conference in the recent TV deal, and now he's not hiding it, anymore.
This is something that was ongoing prior to Saban's arrival, and mind you, he's not implicated in any way, but folks, Alabama fans can say what they like, but the bottom line is that they were told if any major/serious infractions occurred while they were on probation for the Albert Means' thing, then the punishment would likely include a shutdown of their football program.
Alabama's report to the NCAA already included the term "gross failure to monitor" the situation, and that's admission of fault...and its DANGEROUSLY close to being construed as "Lack of Institutional Control" depending upon which lawyers you ask...
Be careful, folks...
Wait a minute; wait a minute. At Bama's home games, are they singing, "We just whooped your a$$," or "We just wiped your a$$"? Cause, if it's the latter, I think I get it now.
I love Schadenfreude...
North Division: Maryland, Virginia, Virginia Tech, North Carolina, North Carolina State, Duke
South DIvision: Wake Forest, Clemson, Georgia Tech, Florida State, South Florida, Miami, Fla.
Damn mid-westerner...
:-)
Hense the word "plain".
Now, please explain to me why the Big Televen can't count.
By having divisions, they are ensuring themselves of not having the best teams play thereby hurting the BCS chances of having#1 vs #2 play.
IE. Last year, the Big 12 had Okl vs Missouri in their title game.
Missouri was at least the 5th best team in the conference.
They got a crap matchup which hurt ratings and did nothing to solve their BCS mess between Texas and OKL. The game should have served as a defacto playoff game elimating a team from BCS discussion.
Another example- Two years ago SEC had LSU and Ten in the game. Ga was ranked in the top 10 and had a better record than Tennessee. Ten won the division and played in the title game. Last year thru luck, the SEC got the best two teams in Florida and Alabama. They got a great rating and helped to clear up some of the national title picture.
The divisions should be thrown out. The top two teams in the conference play in the conference title game serving as potential elimination games for the BCS.
Coastal: Miami, NCSU, Wake, UMD, UVA, & BC.
Atlantic (or more inland): FSU, Clemson, GT, UNC, Duke, & VT.
That's still likely to leave the Atlantic a lot stronger than the Coastal but it's not a terrible split. Then again, it's not really any better.
The one thing that I think is weird about the ACC is that, in order to preserve some traditional rivalries while creating similarly competitive divisions, the ACC created annual out-of-division "permanent rivals" which create permanent unfairness. For example, in the Atlantic division, Wake gets to play (Coastal) Duke every year (which is practically a guaranteed win) whereas Clemson has to play (Coastal) GT every year, which is a 50-50 proposition. Therefore Wake has a perennial advantage over Clemson to win the Atlantic Division.
The ACC could have avoided that problem by putting rivals in the same divsion. To be honest, I'm not sure who everybody's rivals are, but if I had to take a whack at it, I think it would look something like this. All the NC schools are rivals of each other. Clemson & GT. UVA & VT & maybe UMD. BC & Miami, and Miami & FSU. So a rivalry split (and an abandonment of the unfair "permanent rivals" scheduling) could be something like:
Coastal: UMD, UVA, VT, BC, Miami, FSU.
Atlantic: NCSU, UNC, Duke, Wake, Clemson, GT.
Of course that makes the Coastal a lot stronger than the Atlantic, and it prevents the possibility of the FSU-Miami dream match-up championship game were those two schools to return to power.
Coastal: Miami, NCSU, Duke, UMD, UVA, & BC.
Atlantic (or more inland): FSU, Clemson, GT, UNC, Wake, & VT.
Coastal would be way stronger than the Atlantic. Bad idea.
however, they have the academics, and in order to exchange bc with another southern school, one would have to look at 1. navy (20 mins. from umd), 2. take someone from the sec, south carolina gets my vote, or 3. get a southern fcs school with the academics, cuz those sec schools won't give up the money they make from cbs, usf, ecu, and ucf (the other possibilities) don't have the academics, navy gets my vote, not only do they have the academics and the fans, but they also don't have to deal with separating from another conference, plus lacrosse would benefit, and so too would mens soccer, which the acc has strength nationally, basketball would suffer, but i don't think it'll be a big deal
i like the north south divisions clemson joe posted, switching bc for navy
Virginia Tech T-Shirts
Divisions do nothing to help get the best two teams in the conference championship game (ie. Big 12 last year)
Have all 12 teams play rotating schedule keeping rival games.
Top two teams play for the conference title.
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