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Re: Clemson to interview Bud Foster this weekend?

RazzMaTazz — Tue, 18 Nov 2008 02:12:28 -0000

Sorry Tampa Gator, but that's not good enough. I'll need a complete thesis with footnotes and a bibliography for any future posts. :-)

Good post. You raised some great points about Meyer that I didn't realize. Your post explains why Meyer's offense has been putting up basketball scores this season-- now that he's got the kind of talent that he wants. 50+ points? It's insane. I can't wait to see the Alabama game.

Re: Clemson to interview Bud Foster this weekend?

TampaGator — Mon, 17 Nov 2008 10:49:06 -0000

RMT'z:

Of course I cherry picked examples....it's a comment on a message board--I wasn't developing a comprehensive thesis on the topic; just siting some "cases in point" to illustrate what I was saying.

Now, as for the couterpoints--I'll restrict my comments to Urban Meyer and UF, since it is the most salient to the point I was making. The success that UF has enjoyed under Urban Meyer is is exactly the source that's motivating the the conventional wisdom to favor radical chancge over what I call "running with the grain." Even announcing the termination of coaches mid-season, rather than waiting until the season has run its course--has become the rule rather than the rare exception--IMO, largely influenced by the success that UF has enjoyed, since the hiring of Meyer. The point of my post then, was simply to suggest caution in the "radical change" mentality. If your thinking Urban Meyer and UF, think long and hard, before you pull the trigger, for a # of reasons.

1. "Urban Meyers" don't "grow on trees." To think, "...hey, we need to go and get us one of them Urban Meyers..." is siplistic, superficial and flawed, to say the least. He was special enough for 2 established FB powers--UF and Notre Dame--to expressly "clear the decks" in order to make a play for just for him. He is very rare. Other coaches may prove to be his equal and perhaps even his supperior down the road; but at the time of his hiring, he stood head and shoulders above the exisiting pool--even H&S above STEVE SPURRIER. No one is standing out like that now.

2. UF was Talent laden (loaded) when Meyer was hired, and even he had difficulty using the talent base--because his system ran against the grain of the existing talent base. He had to compromise somewhere between conforming the talent to fit his system, and adjusting his system to fit the existing talent base.... This b/t/w, his fourth year, is the first year we are seeing his system work the way it's designed to--and even that, is the beneficiary of---well, keep reading....

3. The Gators Defense carried them to that first NC--not Meyer's "revolutionery" spread O;

4. The Gators got lucky as hell in that 2nd season--3 blocked kicks alone v. South Carolina, along with a pile of other breaks...

Point being: Meyer's "radical system change" didn't yield that first NC; the existing talent base combined with his discipline, and generous serving of luck, did. Many programs seek to emulate the UF/Meyer hire--yet it was a "perfect storm"; hence emulating it is not a matter of following a playbook; UF was simply the beneficiary of a series of turns of events, and circumstances--and only then, playing their hand well.

So if your looking for fast dividends--you're better off running with the grain, than favoring radical change (i.e.--you oughtn't bank on lady luck; she's a rather fickle one...).

That's all I was saying...and I'm just one guy posting his opinion on a message board.

GO GATORS!!

Re: Clemson to interview Bud Foster this weekend?

RazzMaTazz — Sun, 16 Nov 2008 15:29:44 -0000

I think Kiffin would be a good choice for Clemson. I don't see the attraction to Venebles. Oklahoma's defense is ranked about 50, and lots of Sooners fans would be happy to see him go. Foster's defense at VT has been good, but (even though I don't know much about him) he just doesn't seem like a HEAD coach type. Muschamp seems more like a head coach.

Dabo Swinney has a handicap in winning the job in that he hasn't owned the team long enough to correct all of the entrenched problems with the players and the coaches. And he can't really fire and replace everyone that he might like. If he did get the job, he might be handicapped because great OCs, DCs, assistants, and recruits might be reluctant to sign on with Clemson for fear of the long term stability in the coaching staff.

Re: Clemson to interview Bud Foster this weekend?

RazzMaTazz — Sun, 16 Nov 2008 15:18:26 -0000

I think you cherry picked a few examples that support your assertion that you should hire a coach that fits your existing style of football. But I think you could come up with other examples where a new style led to success. For example, didn't Rich Rodriguez completely revamp WVU's style of football? Mike Leach revamped Texas Tech. Urban Meyer at Florida, Carroll at USC, Gundy at OSU, Davis at UNC, Spurrier at SoCar, Johnson at GT, etc. The game of football evolves through innovative coaches.

Re: Clemson to interview Bud Foster this weekend?

Darrell3559 — Sun, 16 Nov 2008 10:51:56 -0000

As a lifelong Clemson fan that remembers the Pell Years. I think the main ingredient for hiring a new head coach should come from within the camp. I see the reputation of Dabo and what he has done at his coaching position. It seems to me that Phillips needs to pull his head out of his ass, and stop the micromanaging, and realize the caliber of man who has stepped up to keep the morale of the team going. I may be old fashioned, but I would give the job to Dabo! It seems that this feeding frenzy that is spurred on by the media, has taken the focus of Clemson fans away from the important fact that loyalty and professionalism should be rewarded

Re: Clemson to interview Bud Foster this weekend?

Zac — Sun, 16 Nov 2008 10:47:01 -0000

FSU_fan, first, I think it depends upon whether or not you're talking about Monte or his son, Lane. Second, does Clemson want good coaching or good recruiting? All too often coaching & recruiting are mutually exclusive; they don't necessarily go hand-in-hand.

Thirdly, there's the success (or lack of, as it were) factor of NFL coaches going to the college ranks. On that basis alone, I'm not certain hiring either Kiffin is a good move. JMO.

Re: Clemson to interview Bud Foster this weekend?

Zac — Sat, 15 Nov 2008 11:44:50 -0000

TG, let's not forget WVU with Mullens & Stewart leaning away from the ground game and more toward the passing game. Thus far, 2 of WVU's 3 losses were games where they passed well, but didn't run for $hit.

Re: Clemson to interview Bud Foster this weekend?

Zac — Sat, 15 Nov 2008 11:41:59 -0000

Who's the OC for Appy St? There's I guy I might consider.

Re: Clemson to interview Bud Foster this weekend?

FSU_fan — Fri, 14 Nov 2008 22:51:51 -0000

Well I'll throw in my two cents even though you didn't ask me. I would hire kiffin. I watch the acc coaching searches closely, heck I watch every team in the acc all the time pretty much and I have reviewed all the people I've heard rumored for the spot. Kiffin was the one that I was like "Oh, please don't go to clemson". At the very least he will bring Clemson's recruiting up to the top rung of the ACC (where if you watch recruiting it they are more a tier two of the ACC with VT).

Re: Clemson to interview Bud Foster this weekend?

aVoiceInSC — Fri, 14 Nov 2008 10:57:48 -0000

Great points. I think you're definitely on to something there. As a partial Nebraska fan, I'll never forget how sure I was that the 'Huskers were making a terrible decision by passing on Bo Pellini and going with Callahan. In the end, it looks like i was right. For Nebraska to abandon their bread and butter (especially with it being perfect for the type of players that grow up living, eating, and breathing Cornhusker football) is downright absurd. I wonder if Clemson going with Kiffin is essentially the same.

Bud Foster does seem like the guy who could really hit the ground running. With the talent that we have on defense, I'd love to see what he could do.

Re: Clemson to interview Bud Foster this weekend?

TampaGator — Fri, 14 Nov 2008 10:21:45 -0000

Of all the names mentioned so far, I like Bud Foster best for CU. This guy is accomplished and well seasoned, yet young enough to represent long term prospects--in other words, a great balance between youth and experience (contrast with Kiffin, who's long on youth, not so much on experience). He commands respect, is energetic, and perhaps just the slightest bit overdue for a HC position, having served faithfully and loyally for so many years, in Beamer's shadow.

Additionally, a few programs come to mind, that IMO, deviated significantly from who they were, in an attempt to become something they are not, which have resulted in poor results (generously speaking).

1. Nebraska--abaondons run oriented option O and smash mouth defensive ball, for pass happy B Callahan--catastrophe....

2. Notre Dame--decades of success founded on grinding-it-out running game and stout defenses, shoots for pass happy offense...results in disaster....

3. Michigan--abandons pro-set for spread under RR--not looking good so far;

IMO, Clemson has a solid framework in place; they don't need a king maker. Their hire should be something that doesn't compromise the existing structure, but instead, runs with "the grain", so to speak.

Hence I think Lane Kiffin would be a huge mistake--Callahanesque, in fact (in fact both came from Oak Raid's); also, Venables, Brian Kelly and Brian Hoke have worked a different area of the country and aren't as well connected to the area as Foster, and IMO, represent a deviation from CU's existing structure.

Muschamp would be a solid alternative for the same reasons, but he may not be available.

My $.02

GO GATORS!!

Re: Clemson to interview Bud Foster this weekend?

aVoiceInSC — Fri, 14 Nov 2008 10:17:55 -0000

It has been confirmed.

http://www.thestate.com/tig...

Now, the question I have is, if Bud Foster came, who would be our OC? Could it be Swinney?

Re: Clemson to interview Bud Foster this weekend?

USC1801 — Thu, 13 Nov 2008 21:26:05 -0000

Not Ready For Primetime Skip Holtz??

Re: Clemson to interview Bud Foster this weekend?

Zac — Thu, 13 Nov 2008 21:09:13 -0000

So, howzabout Skip Holz? He's not gargling any marbles.

Re: Clemson to interview Bud Foster this weekend?

Regan — Thu, 13 Nov 2008 20:30:00 -0000

One of these days, I swear Lou Holtz is going to take the cotton balls out of his mouth and have a flawless English accent....

Re: Clemson to interview Bud Foster this weekend?

War_Eagle_Atlanta — Thu, 13 Nov 2008 18:56:21 -0000

Muschamp must have some sort of big buyout to ensure he stays there at least for two years minimum...

Re: Clemson to interview Bud Foster this weekend?

USC1801 — Thu, 13 Nov 2008 18:50:14 -0000

And we are glad he's gone, long gone at USC!! He may be a fine person but as to his coaching abilities. . . they, too, are long gone! In fact, they were non-existent at USC.

Re: Clemson to interview Bud Foster this weekend?

aVoiceInSC — Thu, 13 Nov 2008 18:49:19 -0000

I could definitely see that. I'm not sold on the guy at all, so it's all the same to me.

I know you're an FSU fan, and don't care for Clemson much, but if it were up to you, and you were the guy to realistically hire a new coach that is the best for Clemson, who would you pick?

Re: Clemson to interview Bud Foster this weekend?

Kevin @ Fanblogs — Thu, 13 Nov 2008 18:45:18 -0000

I think there is more to the Muschamp contract than we're being told, IMO, a la a "poison pill" buyout or something similar. He may not be an easy guy to hire.

Re: Clemson to interview Bud Foster this weekend?

Lennie Collins — Thu, 13 Nov 2008 18:11:37 -0000

Lou Holtz is good people!

Re: Clemson to interview Bud Foster this weekend?

aVoiceInSC — Thu, 13 Nov 2008 18:08:49 -0000

So it looks like there's confirmation that TDP does have an interview on Friday. I'm thinking that has to be Bud Foster.

Re: Clemson to interview Bud Foster this weekend?

USC1801 — Thu, 13 Nov 2008 18:06:44 -0000

"Cause he wouldn't get a word in edgewise if he did!

Re: Clemson to interview Bud Foster this weekend?

aVoiceInSC — Thu, 13 Nov 2008 17:44:12 -0000

The word is that Muschamp will be interviewed next week, as Texas has an off week. I really haven't heard Bobby Johnson's name thrown around as much lately.

Re: Clemson to interview Bud Foster this weekend?

Lennie Collins — Thu, 13 Nov 2008 17:38:12 -0000

He gets around! Still down with the Underground! Why don't he interview Lou Holtz?

Re: Clemson to interview Bud Foster this weekend?

War_Eagle_Atlanta — Thu, 13 Nov 2008 17:35:36 -0000

Damn, TD gets around. Obviously, the drop in jet fuel prices has spurred this...