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Re: Should Lane Kiffin recruit convicted rapists?

bronco1 — Wed, 13 May 2009 09:27:34 -0000

It was his cousin for crying out loud. I read up in the blog he was only 13. How big was this kid and how strong. He is now 6' 5"! A man will make mistakes in life, but God never said that he would make the things you do wrong better. He forgives for the past and lets you have the opportunity after salvation to lead as a better example. With this being said, The man should still have to pay for what he has done and not be rewarded by any amount.

TO ALL THE TENNESSEE RESIDENTS WITH YOUNG CHILDREN: DO YOU FEEL COMFORTABLE SENDING YOUR CHILDREN OFF TO COLLEGE WITH STRANGERS AND THEN HOW DOES IT FEEL TO SEND THEM OFF WITH KNOWN RAPIST?

i FEEL THE SPOT LIGHT WILL BE ON THIS MAN AND HE WILL STAY DIRECTED IN THE PATH THAT IS EXPECTED, BUT THERE ARE ALOT OF ATHLETES DESERVING OF THIS SCHOLARSHIP AND MOSTLY THE EDUCATION THAT HAVE BEEN GREAT TO SOCIETY THUS FAR.

Re: Should Lane Kiffin recruit convicted rapists?

Zac — Tue, 12 May 2009 21:44:35 -0000

Now, who can argue with that?

Re: Should Lane Kiffin recruit convicted rapists?

TampaGator — Mon, 11 May 2009 11:18:11 -0000

I know for a fact that I would NOT offer this kid a scholly; but no one asked me.

The actual question posed here, isn't "does he deserve a scholly to play fb?"

It's: does his background warrant a complete prohibition against it?

...and as far as I've read, no one has indentified any kind of authority whatsoever to support such a proposition. None at all; just emotional feelings to support his exclusion.

Bottom line: it's Tennessee's scholly, and therefore Tennessee's call.

End of discussion.

Now, that doesn't mean we can't print up copies of that appelate opinion Gatorhippy linked, and circulate it around oppenents' locker rooms prior to game day against the Vols...

...and it doesn't mean we can't circulate it among potential TN recruits ("you wanna' shower with this fella'? Don't drop the soap...")...

...nor does it mean that we can't bring toilet plungers to the stadium when Tennesse is playing (think Game Day)...

Just means the "Boy Wonder" once again, exercised piss-poor judgment.

...ahhh the Boy Wonder....we couldn't have chosen a better coach for Tennessee if we were allowed to make the selection ourselves.

GO GATORS!!

Re: Should Lane Kiffin recruit convicted rapists?

gatorhippy — Sun, 10 May 2009 21:07:32 -0000

I would not have been so stupid...

Simple as that...

Re: Should Lane Kiffin recruit convicted rapists?

Zac — Sat, 09 May 2009 11:40:04 -0000

Yes, GH, but did You answer the question? You have eloquently & intelctually (albiet emotionally - so have I - the emotional part anyway) strongly debated and answered every question thrown at you thus far. Why not answer this one too? This is not to say you have to. I'm just curious is all.

For my part, had I been so stupid, would I have prayed for a "forgiving society"? You betcha!!!

Re: Should Lane Kiffin recruit convicted rapists?

Zac — Sat, 09 May 2009 11:31:17 -0000

GH, at the risk of partially supporting your argument, I have this respone:

All too often have suicide watch teams had a patient under observation, only for that patient to find a way to commit suicide anyway. If this young man was/is a sexual preditor, under constant observation, he would have still found a way (may actually have - we don't know) to satisfy his urges. The point is, he could have if he really was driven to, so badly needed to. That he hasn't (that we know of) speaks in his favor, IMHO.

Re: Should Lane Kiffin recruit convicted rapists?

Zac — Sat, 09 May 2009 11:11:29 -0000

Ron, I'm not certain there are "wrong answers" here, only different ones. Like yourself, I have two sons, but no grandchildren. Like yourself, I hate what happened to the victim. Unlike yourself, I feel that some criminals can be turned around, and that this MAY be one of those cases. To be perfectly honest, I don't know this to be correct; for me, it only feels that way within the limits of what we know. Rightly or wrongly, that's what's going to happen. Again, like yourself, I also admitted in another post I don't know what I'd do, were this to happen to my own. Should the time come, and I hope it never does, I hope to God I'd do the right thing.

Re: Should Lane Kiffin recruit convicted rapists?

USC1801 — Sat, 09 May 2009 11:06:13 -0000

I have read most of what is in this thread, and two points seem to jump out at me:

First, it is our responsibility to forgive - not with strings attached nor with menacing motives hidden beneath the surface. Even if the act was done to our loved ones or ourself.

Secondly, there is a difference between forgiveness and accountability. Often we neglect one or the other in our determinations. Those who lean towards mercy are sometime apt to lump "recompense" in with what they consider an "unforgiving" attitude, and those who favor punishment often forget that forgiveness is essential to relationships and growth, even within the greater context of society.

We all agree that payment for grievous actions are determined by society, but in my opinion there has not been enough time nor occasion for the convicted to demonstrate he has changed.

As has been mentioned, I would prefer the props be taken away and for a lengthy amount of time be given before a priviledge of this magnatude be administered. It affects us all in the long run as the morals of a society are altered one decision at a time.

Re: Should Lane Kiffin recruit convicted rapists?

gatorhippy — Sat, 09 May 2009 05:15:03 -0000

You know, Zac...

I agree that this is an extremely heavy topic...

However, I appreciate a controversial and strong flavored discussion with polarizing viewpoints which this has certainly provided...

And it's been awhile since we really had one here that got people really fired up...

Re: Should Lane Kiffin recruit convicted rapists?

gatorhippy — Sat, 09 May 2009 05:07:04 -0000

You are clearly on a mission to abate redemption of criminals.

No...

I believe in the rehabilitation of criminals across the board and feel it can work...

However, I am not for rewarding child rapists with free educations because they play football well...

Huge difference...

If you haven't noticed yet, you are clearly in the minority position on this blog...

Ummm...no...I actually see more folks against this kid getting a schollie than for it, bub...

Your dissent has been heard loud and clear, but fortunately, your moral principles are not followed.

Dman right, it's been heard and will contiue to be until the thread is either shut down or others stop commenting on it...

And yes, my moral principles do not follow the course of thought of rewarding child raping sociopaths with free educations simply because they're good at football...

This situation was reviewed by judges of law, whose moral vision dwarfs your own...

News flash, chief...

Judges are elected by popular vote and while certain qualifications are due to be in place their "moral vision" is often aligned upon certain tendencies and personal opinions...

In the impartiality it would take to be a fair judge to deem themselves a moral giant above and beyond that of the average citizen would place an undue amount of bias and opinionated decision making in the judicial process...

...and therefore, this young man received a deserving punishment.

Did he really though?

Or was he not tried as an adult and received an extremely light sentence due to a great lawyer and his testimony against the older child rapist?

Subsequent to his punishment, society expects remorse for his actions

Which as noted in the appeals report, he showed none of...

[The defendant] is described by the [DCS’s] Assessment as being a
pseudo-socialized child exploiter, that is that he desired sexual
pleasure through exploitation of his victim. This diagnosis includes
the fact that the offender often rationalizes the offense with little guilt
or remorse. In this case he has placed the blame on the victim and on
the co-defendant, and has consistently minimized his role in the
commission of the offenses.

Just in case you were to lazy to actually become informed and read it...

Along with the fact, he only showed any type of remorse only because it looke like nobody was willing to hand him a free lunch because he's a child rapist...

and like any other American, he deserves a second chance.

Which he has received by not continuing to be remanded to state custody past age 19 or spending his life in jail...

Re: Should Lane Kiffin recruit convicted rapists?

gatorhippy — Sat, 09 May 2009 04:26:32 -0000

And as I pointed out below, Zac...

Universities are in the business of ensuring that those who are most deserving receive the limited number spots in the incoming freshman class each year...

Why should a kid with identical statistics academically,intellectual power and no criminal past be refused admittance to make space for a convicted child rapist displaying the formative tendencies of a sociopath simply because said rapist can play football well?

Why should a football player with identical statistics academically, intellectual power and no criminal past or character issues be pushed aside for a convicted child rapist displaying the formative tendencies of a sociopath simply because said rapist is a little faster, stronger and bigger?

There are PLENTY of other kids who would have loved to receive this schollie that will/have wound up playing at a lower level of football or will remain a walk-on at UT for the time being simply because Kiffin thinks a child rapist can help him win football games...

That shouldn't happen...

Re: Should Lane Kiffin recruit convicted rapists?

gatorhippy — Sat, 09 May 2009 04:14:02 -0000

You're right, Zac..

That's not only a lousy example, but it doesn't even really apply to this situation in any shape or form...

Re: Should Lane Kiffin recruit convicted rapists?

Zac — Sat, 09 May 2009 01:03:38 -0000

You do make a very good point there, Chanaud. Publicity like that, which no doubt over-shadows Hood's attending TN, public out-cry, web-sites, and threads like this one, they all serve to do nothing more than to open old wounds. As folks like us debate the subject, she relives the nightmare, over & over & over...

For the sake of his immortal soul, I sincerely hope this kid as truly made a big turn in his life and continues to do so. For the sake of the souls of other members of the family, I sincerely hope they have not coerced her into standing by him; that her endorsement was truly of her own volition. Most importantly, for the sake of the victim, I sincerely hope she finds peace.

Re: Should Lane Kiffin recruit convicted rapists?

Zac — Sat, 09 May 2009 00:48:31 -0000

Aye-yup. Got you fooled, aye-yup (he said while picking his nose).

Just josh'n T_O, thanks for the props. Though, I should warn ya, my wife may not agree with ya.

Re: Should Lane Kiffin recruit convicted rapists?

Chanaud — Fri, 08 May 2009 22:05:14 -0000

I think the majority on this board had forgotten that he already received his second chance in life. Fortunately for him he was a young minor and received a lessor punishment compared to his cohort.

Personally, I don't think he's that remorseful. Per Chris Low's report, Hood made a public statement that he is sorry that he stood frozen while his cousin was being raped. The court report differs from his public statement. Seems to me he's not owning to his "mistake".

I feel sorry for the victim. Her family including Hood seems selfish. Just because he wants to play at a Division I school, her nightmare has be relived and is plastered all over the news. Shame on Hood. Shame on the family.

Re: Should Lane Kiffin recruit convicted rapists?

Zac — Fri, 08 May 2009 21:32:58 -0000

Ya know, guys. While this thread may lend a whole new meaning to "Butt Buddies", as emotional as it's been, I'd welcome one of those articles right about now.

Re: Should Lane Kiffin recruit convicted rapists?

Zac — Fri, 08 May 2009 21:31:32 -0000

GH, I can't imagine anyone of us on here having participated in such a thing when we were 13. I can imagine most of us having gotten beaten up by the 17 year old, had we attempted to stop him, were we to have found him in the act. I don't think that's BuckStop's point.

I understand his point to mean as a society, with regards to due process, it has been determined by those in charge, that this is OK. He did the crime, did the time, and now he's free. I don't know how other states would have handled this. Though, as you framed it, "I'm "society" or at least a part of it in general and I don't deem that ANY child rapist can ever fully pay their price... Nor any rapist actually... Nor does it look like the majority here in our little "society" of Fanbloggers does either..." Well, rightly or wrongly, what you deem in this matter doesn't apply. Only the law applies, and the law has spoken.

I'll give you a lousy example: Some years back as a resident of Connecticut, the guy I didn't vote for was elected governor. Within three months he was strong-arming bills through the state senate; one was a state income tax (CT never had one before.), another was a fire-arms restriction law (was in vogue politically at the time). The state senate wound up tied on both issues. The Lieutenant Governor, a non-elected official appointed by the governor, held the tie-breaker and voted in favor both times. I didn't even get to vote for or against this guy (gal actually); yet, she got the swing vote enacting two of the lousiest laws ever put on the books in CT. That income tax set me back financially a good 3 years. But, I had no complaint, because due process was served.

Re: Should Lane Kiffin recruit convicted rapists?

Zac — Fri, 08 May 2009 21:09:51 -0000

"Only a small handful of people seem to think that a juvenile rapist should be afforded a free education because he's a good football player..."

GH, I have no issue what-so-ever with you're disagreement with any of my opinions on this thread or others. You have that right. My late father, among many others, fought that we could maintain that right.

That said, consider this quote from the article above:

"...model student on and off the field," with high grades and higher test scores."

I'm glad he's a good football player, but I'm in favor of his getting a free education, because it looks to me as if he earned it, at least in part, in the class room. The good "football player" for TN is mearly an ancilary benefit.

Re: Should Lane Kiffin recruit convicted rapists?

jake — Fri, 08 May 2009 16:01:29 -0000

@ GatorHippy:

You are clearly on a mission to abate redemption of criminals. If you haven't noticed yet, you are clearly in the minority position on this blog. Your dissent has been heard loud and clear, but fortunately, your moral principles are not followed. This situation was reviewed by judges of law, whose moral vision dwarfs your own, and therefore, this young man received a deserving punishment. Subsequent to his punishment, society expects remorse for his actions, and like any other American, he deserves a second chance.

Evidently, Kiffin is putting his own reputation, and the reputation of UT Athletics, on the line for this athlete. While I have criticized some of Kiffin's prior decisions, I admire his courage in standing up for this young man.

Re: Should Lane Kiffin recruit convicted rapists?

otowngators — Fri, 08 May 2009 14:43:37 -0000

I read, well maybe skimmed, over the court papers that were posted by Gatorhippy. Am I correct that I read Hood, prior to the age of 13, had already had sexual relations with both boys and girls?? Which 10-12 year old boys have consentual sex with other BOYS?? This clearly leads me to believe that 13 year old Hood was RAPED himself.....which would explain his lack of putting a stop to his cousin's rape. He found some kind of satisfaction in watching this pain and suffering occur to someone other than himself this time. Which would not make him an "innocent" bystander that followed the 17-year old's direction. Does this make sense to anyone??

Re: Should Lane Kiffin recruit convicted rapists?

Regan — Fri, 08 May 2009 12:50:17 -0000

GH, the first part of my post was a request that we Fanbloggers, when discussing an issue like this, agree with each other that we can disagree. I have no intention of telling anyone "they're wrong", since we are talking opinions.

I'm also not interested in hearing that "I'm wrong", especially since (TBH), I see where you're coming from 100%.

This IS a complex situation. Had the action taken place when Hood was 19, it would be simple - case closed. But he wasn't. He's the same age I was when I was playing with Legos, and was hanging out with a 17 year old whom he looked up to.

Would I have known better? Definately - I lucked out and got two wonderful parents who loved me and taught me right from wrong at an early age. I don't know what he got dealt, so I have to have an open mind about it.

Was what Hood did wrong? YES.

Was it worthy of more than a few months at Juvie Hall? YES.

Was it worth now having a debate as to whether he should play at UT? YES.

If admitted, should he be watched like a hawk and monitored for the first sign of trouble? YES. (IMHO)

Should his life be destroyed and any chances for redemption gone because of something he did before he could even pay taxes? I don't think so. That's just my opinion, but I'd ask that it be respected.

I know exactly where you're coming from; but I (generally) believe in giving people a second chance, so long as it is done safely for others. I say watch this guy like a hawk, make certain that he knows the deal, and the second it even looks like trouble, boot him.

Put an ankle bracelet on him if you need to, but don't destroy his life when there's a chance he could end up turning it around; that's all I'm saying.

However - I fully understand if you don't agree, bud...

Re: Should Lane Kiffin recruit convicted rapists?

-TE- — Fri, 08 May 2009 11:10:18 -0000

The classic case of youth-driven egomaniacism...

"I can't take being wrong, so I make my point, and when I realize its chock full of holes that'd make a Swiss Cheesemaker misty-eyed, I express an attitude of nonchalant detatchment."

Easy way to never have to admit you're wrong.

But, its okay, BC, we're here to pound it into that thick cranium of yours...

You're wrong. In the words of George Clooney as Michael Clayton in Michael Clayton, "You're way the f*ck wrong."

Go live your life in the real world...Think about someone other than yourself...Then reassess...

Till then, push away from the keyboard for now...

Re: Should Lane Kiffin recruit convicted rapists?

gatorhippy — Fri, 08 May 2009 10:10:50 -0000

And to build more so on your thought of him being deserving of his second chance (which he has already received by just being free to roam outisde of state custody)...

Would you have wanted him picked up by FSU?

Re: Should Lane Kiffin recruit convicted rapists?

OU_Ron — Fri, 08 May 2009 09:33:54 -0000

I haven’t posted but one comment on this thread for fear of saying the wrong thing or getting into a confrontation with someone and I didn’t want that to happen…..with that being said, here is my feelings..

My wife and I were not fortunate enough to have a daughter; we had two sons….I do however have two granddaughters…..I can’t even imagine the thought of someone violating them in such a way as the victim was in this case.

My hats off to you that have found the faith to forgive this young man….I don’t think I ever could….

I don’t care if he was 13 or 30, I would still be looking for both of those guys….and for all of our sakes, it would be best if I didn’t find them.

Now, should he be able to play football for Tenn…I think my answer is obvious..

Re: Should Lane Kiffin recruit convicted rapists?

gatorhippy — Fri, 08 May 2009 09:10:47 -0000

I'll agree on your "lapse of judgement" comment and ask this...

How exactly has Hood "screwed" himself?

He was still awarded TN's Mr. Football...

He still has received a full ride to play football...

In the end he hasn't been screwed at all...